Herbstreit joins the legends for a BCS roundtable

Kirk Herbstreit joined the Legends Poll voters on a conference call this week. Herbstreit and the Legends discussed the quandary that the BCS is facing with potential unbeatens: SEC Champion, Texas, TCU, Cincinnati and Boise State.

The featured roundtable discussion offered a variety of views about No. 4 TCU and their argument to be included in the BCS Championship Game.

LaVell Edwards: I believe TCU is going to come out of this on the short end.  It’s a shame they won’t get a shot at it because clearly they’re the best team I’ve ever seen around here.  They are legitimate in my mind.  We kind of lock into Florida, Alabama and Texas all year long and that’s the way it’s been.   I definitely think TCU could beat Alabama, Florida or Texas, no question in my mind they can.

George Welsh: I saw TCU play Virginia and I was very impressed.  I really like TCU.  I don’t know what they have going for them but they have a lot.  They have a great pass rush; they do a great job on defense.  Now the quarterback who was off to a slow start against Virginia is obviously playing a lot better.  I like TCU also.

John Cooper: I saw Texas play last year.  I went out and watched the Fiesta Bowl.  I like Texas and we all like Mack Brown but Gene Stallings’ right- Texas is one-dimensional.  If McCoy has a bad day, Texas is going to get beat.  Their biggest win all year was over Oklahoma State.  I don’t know about you guys but I watched Oklahoma State last weekend and I was not impressed.

We talk about TCU but TCU went to Clemson and beat a pretty good Clemson team, went to BYU and won that game pretty easily over a pretty good BYU team, they beat Utah who is 9-2.  I would give TCU a slight edge over Texas.  We don’t even need to talk any more about Alabama and Florida.  Those two teams are going to play each other and the winner of that game is going to play for the national championship.  We need to be talking about Texas and TCU and see who should play the winner of that SEC game.  I think if TCU went against Texas right now they would beat them.

Gene Stallings: I’m not sure that Texas will beat Texas A&M.

Pat Dye: Looking at those four football teams, if they all played the best they could play, Alabama’s the only one TCU couldn’t beat.  I just think physically they would beat them.  I think Florida’s got some problems and y’all say Texas has some but I don’t see any problems in Tuscaloosa.

Terry Donahue: I saw TCU two weeks ago play in person.  I’ve seen Alabama twice (in person).  TCU has the best defensive football team I’ve seen all year except for Alabama.  I just thought they were so fast at every position.  They have eight receivers they throw into a game and it’s hard to tell one from another.  I voted them ahead of Texas in the poll because if you consider every facet of the game I believe they could beat Texas or at least deserve a shot at beating Texas.  So I voted them ahead of Texas.

RC Slocum: I have some of the feelings that everyone else has but I think Texas is a good defensive team and an explosive offensive team.  What happens is that we talk about the Boises who beat the people they have to beat and Texas does that too.  I don’t know if we’ve seen Texas’ best game.  They came back in the second half and beat Oklahoma.  They ran the ball some then.  I have the same concern Gene has, you’d like for them to be more balanced.  That’s what they do.  They make so many big plays in the passing game.  They’ll run it in there every once and a while.  I’d be more concerned about their kicking game than anything else.

I just wonder in a match up with Florida or Alabama… all three of those teams are good defensive teams but how many can make the big explosive plays on offense and I would say Texas.  Alabama’s better at running the football and I appreciate that.  Florida is better at running the ball.  But if you ask which of those three offenses is the most explosive I’m going to say Texas is.  All three are comparable defensive teams.

Everything you hear about TCU is good and deservedly so.  That coach has done a great job.  They’re a speed defensive team that would give anybody problems.  I think that would be a good match up.  I would still take Texas in that match up maybe just for psychological reasons.  They played Texas a year ago and they played Texas for a half.  TCU was TCU and Texas was Texas.  If those two played today, I’d pick Texas.

I think they’re so good at what they’re doing that they’re choosing to throw the ball.  They’re promoting McCoy for the Heisman.  They had trouble in the Oklahoma game and they came out in the second half and gashed Oklahoma running the ball.  I thought it was the difference in the ball game.  I know Mack, way down deep, likes to throw the ball.  They do it by design and man, they do it in such a hurry.  My son’s up in Green Bay coaching and we’ve got guys who coached in the pros.  Coaches there talk a lot about explosive plays.  You can’t line up against those good NFL defensive teams and grind the ball down the field over and over and score enough points to win the game.  You have to make explosive plays.  That’s what prompts my question of which team out of Alabama, Florida and Texas can make explosive plays.

From what I’ve seen, I would take Texas first, Florida second and Alabama third in making explosive plays.  If you ask me who can grind the ball out I would put Texas third.  You get in those games and anybody’s going to have a hard time with those three defenses moving the ball.  It comes down to who can get the big chunks and I think Texas has the ability to do that more than the other two.  TCU is explosive too, they do a good job throwing the ball and they run the ball.  It would be a good match up.

Fisher DeBerry: Having played TCU for many, many years and knowing their background, they can play with anybody — I guarantee you defensively.  The reason I haven’t voted them higher than I have is because I don’t think their offense is that good.  The quarterback has played well the last three or four weeks and it would be a heck of a match up to see TCU play Texas just like it will be to see Alabama play Florida.

Kirk Herbstreit: I’m just intrigued listening to this.  I think the one thing that’s changed with the BCS from 1998 to now is non-automatic qualifier — the perception of the Utah, Boise State, TCU or whoever it happens to be.  I remember in ‘98,’99, 2000 you would never even imagine having this discussion about TCU.  I think the success of Boise and Utah and others of not just getting to a BCS bowl game but what they’ve done when they’ve gotten there, Utah beating Alabama last year in the Sugar Bowl, I think proves that these teams can play one game with these teams.

One coach was talking about the schedule and doesn’t TCU outpersonnel teams they play? I personally feel that the MWC is one of the most underrated conferences in the country because they have a TV program with Versus and nobody sees these teams.  For TCU to go to Virginia, to go to Clemson, to go to Air Force, to go to BYU, and go to Wyoming and beat these teams the way they have…I think that’s a more impressive resume that what Texas has gone through.

Texas hasn’t played anybody outside of Oklahoma and Oklahoma State.  They’ve played nobody all year.  It doesn’t mean they aren’t a great team.  We just won’t know how good they are until they play Nebraska for the Big 12 championship and the national championship to play the winner of the Florida-Alabama game.  We can speculate but we really don’t know how good Texas is.

Legends answer Mr. College Football’s questions

Tony Barnhart from CBS Sports joined the Legends Poll on the weekly conference and asked some burning college football questions.

Barnhart: I would like to ask you about TCU, they look like a very fast, athletic team. What are your impressions?

LaVell Edwards: I think in the first place they are outstandingly coached. I knew they were going to be good on defense, but their quarterback has come a long way. I think he has made the difference; he can run the ball and throw it. They are a very, very solid football team and could stand up with anybody in the country.

Terry Donahue: I had not yet seen them play in person, but only on our DVDs. But I was really impressed with them. They can run everywhere on defense. And offensively the quarterback is very good and just knows how to play. They have a lot of dimensionality to their offense. It’s hard for defenses to find the ball and they have a great kicking game.

Barnhart: What do you like about Georgia Tech?

Pat Dye: Nobody has stopped them. I thought that defensively they are about average. And I wouldn’t have given Georgia any chance against Georgia Tech, but after Saturday verses Auburn they fought the hell out of Auburn. I don’t know, but if they don’t have some new defensive schemes they won’t be able to stop Tech. The Tech quarterback is starting to throw the ball a little better now.

Barnhart: Can Cincinnati play the power game vs. TCU?

Don Nehlen: Offensively this guy (Brian Kelly) is amazing. The big question is they have a week off with Pitt and Illinois left. Their problem defensively is they are small and can’t stop the run. I think they will have trouble with Pitt. It will be interesting, but I think they are more of a # 9 or # 10 team, not in the top 5.

Computer rankings are a tool for voters

• Donahue has a lot of respect for computer polls.
• Donahue: “Computers don’t see how fast Jerry Hughes is.”
• Billingsley agrees with Donahue. He says that computer rankings should be used as a tool for the informed voter.

Donahue: All Boise State does is win games

• Donahue said all Boise State does is win games.
• Donahue said the system is flawed unless you have a playoff.
• Donahue said he came away from the TCU-Utah game convinced that TCU is the best of the non-BCS conference teams.
• Donahue said Texas looks great, but their schedule doesn’t show for it.

Pac-10 roundtable, Stanford front-runner

John Robinson: There are nine teams that are happier than hell in the Pac-10 and one that’s in the tank.  I don’t have to tell you which one that is.  It looks like the Oregon-Oregon State game is going to be a big deal.  I think the winner goes on to the Rose Bowl.  Both teams are well coached.  I think Riley and Kelly have both done a great job.  Oregon is one of those teams, like Georgia Tech, that you just don’t want to play.  They are wild on offense and really hard to handle.  USC never got it going this year.  I don’t think the team ever improved from the start.  Their philosophy is kind of a wide open, pass-oriented offense.  They got caught up with the freshman quarterback, then he got injured.  He wasn’t able to lift them and in the meantime their defense got worse.  I don’t know if they just don’t have the speed they did in the past.  Something is missing on defense because it’s just awful.  But it’s great times in the Pac-10.  There have been great games.  I don’t know how strong anybody is but it’s sure a good conference from within.  There’ll be a new team in the Rose Bowl.

Did Pete Carroll’s assistants leaving for new jobs have an impact on the team?

Don James: I didn’t think so but maybe it’s true.  Pete Carroll is the defensive coordinator.  The offense hasn’t changed, the coaches have changed.  Maybe with them coming in from Denver, they had a difficult time with it.  They weren’t very dynamic.  They don’t like to run the ball.  They will very seldom run the ball twice in a row.  They’re a great offensive team when it’s going.  This is the first time the quarterback and the receivers (they lost their best receiver) didn’t get it going.  They didn’t have other people to come in there.  I think that probably made a difference, a combination of things.  Not a good year.

Frank Kush: USC has the talent, but they just don’t have their act together offensively or defensively.  It seems like one of those internal problems where the coaches don’t know who to play.  We’ve got the same problem here at Arizona State.  We’ve gone through three quarterbacks and we still don’t know what we want to do.  It’s unfortunate because it’s affecting the team in general, psychologically in my opinion and certainly offensively here at Arizona State.

John Ralston: I feel the same way, I think Stanford is the best team in the Pac-10.

John Cooper: I was talking to the Ohio State coaches and they still think USC was the best team they’ve played all year for what it’s worth.

Robinson: I think a number of things worked against them.  They’ve had a change in the coaching staff and that got them off a little bit.  Their overall squad isn’t as fast as it used to be.  You don’t get a sense of that speed.  You look at some of these teams and say “Wow, they’re fast” and you just don’t say that about USC this year.  They’re good, they’re physical and all that, but that never happened.  They got caught up early too in the quarterback thing.  They were going with the freshman starter and than he got hurt.  It seemed like it used up all their attention and the rest of the team didn’t come along.  They didn’t do well.  You’ve got to have some perspective.  They’ve been champions seven year in a row in the Pac-10 and contending to be national champions so this is an aberration in that regard.  I don’t think there is dissension or discontentment.  They just aren’t doing it.  John Ralston made the point that Stanford is really good.  Maybe the rest of the Pac10 has come up and is not afraid of them.

Jim Harbaugh is a guy who says, “I’m not afraid of you, I’m going to kick your ass,” and he did.

And then there’s Oregon.  No one wants to play Oregon.  They’re like Georgia Tech.  You just don’t want to play those guys that are crazy.  They run all over the damn place and you don’t know where the ball is.  A lot of things have conspired against USC, but there’s no falling off the mountain.  They may have slipped down from the top, but they’ve got their hiking boots on and they’ll get their ass back up there.

Terry Donahue: I think one of the things to me that has been the most interesting about USC over the last couple of years is that they have kind of moved away from the really hard, physical running game USC traditionally has always had.  It was one of those things they always had.  They would pound on you with good backs and really good offensive linemen.  It doesn’t seem like that philosophy is ingrained at USC any longer.  It seems that they’ve gotten away from that and it seems to me they’ve become so reliant on the quarterback position to play.  They’ve had Heisman Trophy winners and first round picks at quarterback and they’ve been really good in the past.  But still in terms of leading with the run and countering with the pass, I think they do more of the opposite now.  When you have a young quarterback who makes a few mistakes things can blow up on you.

Ralston: Stanford’s red-shirt freshman quarterback has come on strong.   A guy who is a red-shirt freshman playing with the varsity you would expect not to be very good, but he’ll keep Stanford up there as long as he’s there.  We keep talking about their running back but their quarterback is as good as anybody.

TCU is the real deal

• Donahue was really impressed with TCU against Utah.
• Donahue said that TCU’s defensive unit is fast and aggressive.
• Donahue said the Horned Frogs offensive depth is tough to keep up with.
• Billingsley said that Cincinnati has played the toughest schedule out of the No. 3 – No. 5 teams.

This time, Ducks get best of Boise

Boise State leads Oregon in the USA Today, Harris and AP polls.  Boise State beat Oregon, 19-8, when they met in the season opener.

So why, when they turned in their ballots Sunday, did 14 of 17 Legends Poll voters rank the 7-1 Ducks ahead of the 8-0 Broncos?

Click on the image below to read the full story in SN Today

	Legends Poll
November 2, 2009 – Week 9

Roundtable: Dissecting the top-3

On this week’s conference call, the Legends discussed the rationale for ranking Florida, Alabama and Texas in the No. 1 – No. 3 spots. RC Slocum broke down Texas and others chimed in on the LSU-Florida game. Terry Donahue is one of the voters who likes Alabama in the top spot.

Slocum: Texas is winning every week and you have to give them some credit for that, but they’re just inconsistent.  Early on (in the season) I thought they weren’t playing very well on defense and I worried about their special teams. But the other day they won the game on special teams and defense. So, we’ll find out this week.  They’re playing Oklahoma in the biggest test they’ve had.  It appears to me that Colt McCoy is turning the ball over.  He’s playing like he did the year before last — just kind of an average guy.  Last year he was the difference in their team.  This year he’s had a less than spectacular start.

I don’t think Texas has the defense — ranking these teams I had Texas at No. 3. They don’t have a defense like Florida and Alabama, I don’t think they can run the ball like Florida and Alabama.

Donahue: The best teams I’ve seen so far are Florida and Alabama.  I’ve done (color commentary) Alabama twice and Alabama is a team to me with no apparent weaknesses.  They’ve got a whole lot of athleticism everywhere around their football team.  Their offensive line is very good, maybe not as good as Florida’s, but certainly good.  They’ve got a whole group of running backs they can throw at you.  The quarterback is better than I ever thought he would be after watching him in the opening game against Virginia Tech.  Greg McElroy is really playing well for them.  He’s good with the ball.

Florida’s offensive line is the most impressive line I’ve seen in a lot of years.  I’d have to go back to some of the great lines, you know, over the years to see a better one than Florida’s offensive line.  So those are the two best teams I’ve seen.

Slocum: I’m kind of curious about the LSU game.  I was impressed with LSU’s speed and everything and I’m curious about in the poll if you play Alabama who we all have as number two and you get beat 13-3, I don’t know why you drop so far.  You know, you play a team ranked ahead of them and you think the team ahead of them should win and they won by a fairly close margin so I didn’t mark them down much.  I think LSU is one of the better teams around.

Don James: Well, one thing is they didn’t play that well out here in Washington, you know.  They played a very average football team and struggled to win.  That was just the opener and we all know how openers are so we all know how openers are.

Bill Mallory: I think the big question with LSU is their offense.  I’m still not sure how good of an offense they really are.

Vince Dooley: I think the quarterback (Jordan Jefferson) is still inexperienced and that’s a problem with them.  I think they have great athletes and they’ve won a lot of close games which is part of winning I guess.  Despite the fact that they got beat 13-3 I thought Florida was a much, much stronger football team.  Everything was going for LSU in the ball game, but Florida still played well.

Slocum: When you play the No. 1 team in the nation and lose 13-3, you probably played pretty well.  They’re a one-loss team now, and I compare them to other one-loss teams.  Southern Cal lost to a Washington team that’s not very good.  So USC with one loss compared to losing to the No. 1 team in college football, I didn’t mark them down as far.

SN Radio: Coaching Legend Terry Donahue

UCLA Coaching Legend Terry Donahue chats with Tim Brando on Sporting News Radio about the top teams in the Legends Poll, the merits of having a college football playoff, and much more!

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